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marker_only_loss=True ablation on #295's lc_long — disentangle gradient dilution from undertraining

kind: experiment

Context

#295 found that training on ~1050-token completions (lc_long) implants [ZLT] at 0/100 librarian source-rate — the marker never appears at the end of any eval completion. #297 re-evaluated the same adapter at max_new_tokens=2048 and confirmed the result is not an eval-truncation artifact (mean eval completion length ~1900 Qwen tokens, well under the 2048 budget, still 0/100 librarian).

With truncation ruled out, the leading mechanism in #295's interpretation is gradient dilution by content tokens preceding the marker. Under whole-assistant-turn loss (marker_only_loss=False, the default for the leakage / persona-coupling family — see #271, #232, #246), the [ZLT] token is roughly 0.1% of the loss signal per 1050-token example. At r=32, α=64 LoRA, lr=1e-5, 3 epochs, the marker may simply not get enough gradient mass to be implanted.

Pre-registered in #295's plan v3 §10c as the load-bearing follow-up; filed here as a tracked issue so it doesn't fall off the radar.

Experiment

One condition. Re-train lc_long with the only change being marker_only_loss=True, marker_tail_tokens=0. All other knobs identical to #295's lc_long cell:

  • Model: Qwen/Qwen2.5-7B-Instruct
  • LoRA: r=32, α=64, dropout=0.05, rslora=True, targets {q,k,v,o,gate,up,down}_proj
  • Optimiser: AdamW, lr=1e-5, cosine schedule, warmup 0.05, 3 epochs
  • Effective batch: 16, max_seq_length 1536, bf16 + flash-attn-2 + gradient checkpointing
  • Data: data/leakage_experiment_issue260/lc_long.jsonl (600 rows, librarian source, asst_excluded bystanders, ~1050-token positive completions, positive:negative total-token mass = 0.50)
  • Seed: 42
  • Loss change: marker_only_loss=True, marker_tail_tokens=0 — CE masked to -100 everywhere except the [ZLT] sub-tokens on positives + EOS on every example

Eval

Identical protocol to #295 Leg-1: 11 personas × 20 EVAL_QUESTIONS × 5 completions per persona = 1100 generations, vLLM batched at T=1.0, top_p=0.95, max_new_tokens=2048 (4× the original budget, matching #297's resolution of the truncation question). [ZLT] case-insensitive substring rate.

Pass / fail criterion

OutcomeInterpretation
Librarian source-rate recovers to ≥0.20Gradient dilution was the cause. The whole-assistant-turn-loss regime cannot implant a single end-of-completion marker at 1050-token completions in this LR/epoch regime, but isolating the loss signal restores it. Updates the #295 length-null story: length per se isn't preventing implantation; loss-dilution is.
Librarian source-rate remains 0/100 (or floor-noise <0.05)Gradient dilution is not the cause. The issue is upstream — effective LR / parameter count too low for a single-token target embedded in a 1050-token sequence, or natural-EOS preference dominates. Promotes a fresh follow-up on LR scaling.
Librarian source-rate intermediate (0.05–0.20)Mixed result. Gradient dilution is part of the story but undertraining contributes too. Suggests a 3-condition follow-up: marker-only + 6 epochs, marker-only + lr=5e-5, marker-only baseline.

Compute

1× H100 80GB, ~30 min training + ~5 min eval. compute:small.

Recipe-drift note (carried over from this morning's #295 audit)

When interpreting the result against #271's librarian @ 0.67 anchor, remember that #295's lc_* cells use effective batch 16 + max_seq_length 1536, while #271 used effective batch 64 + max_seq_length 1024. The reproduction gap between #271 and #295's matched-shape lc_medium (0.31) is partly recipe drift, not solely length sensitivity. This ablation can't fix that — to close the drift question, the right follow-up is a separate lc_medium @ batch=64, max_seq=1024 rerun.

Source issues

  • #295 — parent (length sweep that produced the lc_long 0/100 result)
  • #297 — closed the truncation alternative
  • #271 — reference recipe anchor (librarian @ 0.67)
  • #65, #66 — prior marker_only_loss=True recipes for reference

Timeline · 2 events

  1. state_changed· user· proposedarchived
  2. epm:absorbed· agent
    Absorbed by #365 — factor screen for marker implantation + leakage (2^4 factorial over length-location, persona-presence
    Absorbed by #365 — factor screen for marker implantation + leakage (2^4 factorial over length-location, persona-presence, on-policy, marker-only-loss). Marker-only-loss ablation generalized to a main effect (factor D), tested at both completion-length levels.

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